ACC Sportive

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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Toks » Mon May 24, 2010 4:21 pm

mmm...why not choose a charity home and abroad. A premiership footballer got some stick recently on the Talksport Radio show because he was raising funds for a charity he set up in the West Indies for poor kids who lack resources and help for their soccer training club. It was only when he pointed out he is funding a similar project over here that people stopped with the Charity begins at home stuff and were more positive about his efforts. I'm happy to support Alan's project but I''d be even happier if we could raise funds to support something in our local community too. Maybe offer to pay for a number of track days at Herne Hill for local kids or by a couple of some cheap road bikes and get some local kids on bikes
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby kieran » Mon May 24, 2010 4:37 pm

Before 'we' begin planning on what to do with the profits - how much would one expect to make?

Would if be a case like cake sales in schools? where often almost more money is spent by the cake bakers than is taken in by the school at the sale? The only reason the school makes money is that it doesn't incur the costs.
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Alan M » Mon May 24, 2010 4:42 pm

These are all good points worthy of consideration if not endless debate, he said hoping not to sound toooooooo cynical.... :D
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Jojo » Mon May 24, 2010 7:18 pm

[quote="Alan M"][quote="kieran"]don't you mean motivated? Anyway if it was put to the vote Alans charity would get mine. My general take on charities is that bad and all as some have it here it is much worse elsewhere in most parts of the world.


Probably verbing my nouns - bad habit, but hey whatever........, thanks. Anyway it isn't a charity in the formal sense - its really just a group of cyclists trying to make it happen but the club does have a legal status with a lawyer's registration and I have a trusted local contact for its administration.

I dont mean to sound cynical, but if its not a charity, but a club "trying to make it happen but the club does have a legal status with a lawyer's registration". What does that mean? Also what does "We need and want help but we can offer potential donors and partners the cycling experience of a lifetime".
All it sounds to me is a way of raising money for a developing cycle club that you are closely associated with (looking at the website) It also says "We have a growing membership fuelled by our dynamic and growing local and national economy. Cycling is a growing interest here as people progress from cycling for necessity to cycling for recreation and the local conditions are ideal".
Sounds like they need organisational help rather than money.
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Snoop Doug » Mon May 24, 2010 7:39 pm

[quote="Jojo"]All it sounds to me is a way of raising money for a developing cycle club that you are closely associated with (looking at the website) It also says "We have a growing membership fuelled by our dynamic and growing local and national economy. Cycling is a growing interest here as people progress from cycling for necessity to cycling for recreation and the local conditions are ideal".
Sounds like they need organisational help rather than money.


...sounds the same to me too, that's why I quite like the idea. Mirror it with some kind of support for something back here too and it looks cool to me. I bet the money some folk here spend on a pair of wheels would probably kit half this lot out for a year?? If cycling is a growing interest over there, well let's help them grow it a bit more eh? Wouldn't it be excellent if we could help them fund a sponsored ride or something? Not sure the distance twixt here and there lends itself to us providing organisational support.

Alan - if you can get the nod from committee to work this up into a plan and do, then I'll help out. Perhaps a meet up in a croydon pub w wifi to do some planning/scoping?? :D
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Keith » Mon May 24, 2010 8:04 pm

If Alan's prepared to take on the onorous and time-consuming task of leading the organisation of an ACC Sportive (It'll be a full time job at times!), then I agree with his condition of choosing the good cause where half of any profit goes.

So, can we talk about other topics as well as considering where any profit might go?

I've not done a Sportive for a year or more, so what's required to make a successful Sportive? Here's a few thoughts.

    A good route. Challenging and scenic.
    A "hook" - a name e.g. "Hell of the Ashdown", or some theme e.g. "White Horse" ride. Something to make people choose this sportive over others.
    Decent parking and loos at the start. Sounds simple, but I think it makes a difference.
    Manned food/water stops at suitable places.
    A simple, signposted route.
    Pasta afterwards? This made The Puncheur stand out from others.
    Timing. Chips? Whatever, needs to be accurate and available on website.
    Certificate or medals?
    Photos. I don't think that many people ever buy the photos, so perhaps include free photos in the entry fee?
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Phil H » Mon May 24, 2010 9:06 pm

I agree with Keith.

Re. photos, they are normally extremely expensive. If they were good though (and made me look slim - although maybe nobody is that good) I might buy 5 for £10. When they are one for £10 I will generally buy none. I realise this is up to the photographers, but I would've thought that they could work out that it's better to sell 200 photos for £2 than 10 for £10. Something that people have complained about on other internet fora is that photos are always of people struggling up a hill rather than cornering at speed and looking cool.
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Grahame » Mon May 24, 2010 9:17 pm

For timing, the Beastway kit will be suitable and available.

Addiscombe contributed to buying it, so we'll reach a suitable agreement on use of the system. We may (read probably will) need to charge riders for the chips (a couple of pounds onto the entry fee will cover it), which can be refunded after the event.
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Paul H » Mon May 24, 2010 9:24 pm

Perhaps you could call it the Olympic Sportive [url]http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/olympics/470178/exclusive-2012-olympics-road-race-route.html[/url]

Out of interest, who is going to fund the startup costs and any losses if the entries do not cover them?

How is the volunteer situation going with our current commitments do we have enough for this as well?
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Dombo » Tue May 25, 2010 8:23 am

[quote="Alan M"][quote="Jojo"][quote="Dombo"]Perhaps have a list of (not necessarily cycling) charities on which we can vote to offer our support, rather than laying down conditions at the outset as to where the money should go?
While a budding racing club in Peru is no doubt a worthy cause, I am sure there are as many equally deserving pet projects as there are members of our club that could lay equal claim to a share of any profits.

I with Dom on this one.

Alan, it looks like you have a great connection to this club in Peru and also by reading your blog on your adventures out there and no doubt you will probably get the key to the local village for this charity work. I would personally rather see the money go to a local charity. However the charity choice is one for the committee or a vote. My concern is more the amount of work that is required in a already full sportive calendar and amongst other club calendar commitments. We already struggle to get numbers turning up to marshal on much smaller events and this sportive needs to be something different to the others in the area.



And if this is the general opinion it is fine, but I won't be sufficiently incentivised to lead the project


I don't know how much profit a local sportive is likely to make. However, if raising money for these guys in Peru is your aim why not do a sponsored ride when you're next out there? 100 miles up and down a couple of Andes would probably knock even the hardest Etape, Marmotte, Quebrantahuesos etc into a cocked hat and impress a few people. I raised over £1500 a time for Demelza Children's Hospice just riding the etape in '08 and the SDW in '06. (Admittedly not a bean from any Agreeables despite posting on here so you may need to cast your net a little wider). Do it with a few of the local guys, write an engaging blog to keep people posted and you might find it generates some interest. Maybe even get the Advertiser involved.
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby David.Hilbert » Tue May 25, 2010 10:56 am

How about a London-Brighton-London route?
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Andrew G » Tue May 25, 2010 12:48 pm

[quote="Paul H"]How is the volunteer situation going with our current commitments do we have enough for this as well?

As well as usual I think :roll: . I know Tamar only just had enough to fill the minimum required for the 25 and George was chasing up quite late for the handicap..

I'm all in favour of doing as much as we can as a club, but think that we should ensure that all our current commitments are met properly first. It's a common moan but 70-100 on a CR each week is nothing to boast about to me when it's such hard work to get folk out to help in an Addiscombe promotion, and then it's often the same faces doing numerous duties during the course of the year. It's a club requirement of each of those 70-100 to help out and even if it's a pain in the backside getting up early to help at a TT is a few hours on one morning a year too much to ask?
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Snoop Doug » Tue May 25, 2010 1:54 pm

Thread hijack, yarrrr...

[quote="Andrew G"][quote="Paul H"]How is the volunteer situation going with our current commitments do we have enough for this as well?

As well as usual I think :roll: . I know Tamar only just had enough to fill the minimum required for the 25


No Tamar didn't get enough help, not even the minimum required. I had to man the tollgate roundabout and do number checking there too. One guy doing two jobs on a busy, dangerously fast roundabout. I wonder what kind of carnage it will take at one of our events before all the club leadership truly and sincerely get behind the helper ethos.

Yarrrr, hijack over.
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Maria David » Tue May 25, 2010 2:22 pm

It's not a thread hijack at all Snoop!

Volunteers helping out is absolutely fundamental in the staging of any event, whatever shape or form!
If the club struggles to get people to help out at an event that lasts a couple of hours in the morning or evening, how can they be sure they will get the manpower to cover something that effectively lasts all day and will cover large sections of lanes in Surrey/Sussex/Kent??

I think that if a club is going to put on a sportive having never done one before you need to be absolutely sure you can cover all of the logistics required. Also, if doing such a thing for the first time I would have thought the main aim would be to make sure it is well run and safe. If the focus is simply on raising money you'll risk getting things wrong, unhappy punters and negative image. Not all events automatically make money, especially in the larval stages.

People need to decide if they're doing this because they really enjoy putting on cycling events for the benefit of others and all the “I’m doing something positive for cycling” feeling, or if it is to raise funds. It is not easy to achieve both of these in the inaugural year, especially if you’ve never done this sort of thing before.

Raising a couple of grand for charity can be done in different ways. A club cyclosportive is at the more ambitious end of the scale, and £ for £ is probably not the easiest. However, it is alot more fun if you know what you are doing and get the promised help from everyone!
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Re: ACC Sportive

Postby Snoop Doug » Tue May 25, 2010 2:40 pm

Hi Maria 8) 8) 8)

Some good stuff to add to more....good stuff

I hope Alan gets the nod to get a few folk together to thrash this out. I recall him suggesting a pilot kind of thing maybe later this year with a proper (ahem) one in 2011. Maybe we could convince the club run to be the collective guinea pig for a trial attempt..?

And of course, you are right about the helper issue. In my experience it's not that hard to fix. We have the rules in place to manage it, what's missing is some encouragement and when necessary a wee bit of enforcement (as a last resort). There are VCs in this club who according to the rules should not be on a club run because they have not fulfilled marshalling duties (I can be 100% certain of this for the time I kept records, pretty confident same is still the case now). I've brought this up @ committee previously and those who need to do something about it tend to find that a great time to look @ their shoes. Too much conflict avoidance creates a vacuum. Doesn't nature abhor a vacuum? Something will expand to take its place unfortunately. Hmmm... :roll:
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