More new wheels advice

[Elliot M]

Thinking of buying a pair of wheels to replace my Campag Sciroccos which are worthy of the new (to me) Merlin, or at least relegate them to winter use. Now I've been really going off the idea of system wheels, and am prepared to spend a bit more on something which is rebuildable down the line.

What is the collective ACC wisdom on:

- DT Swiss RR 1.1 32 hole rims on DT Swiss 340 hubs?
I estimate these would be about 1550g [edit: no, that would be with 240s] and just over £300 (bit more than Zondas or Ksyrium Elites, bit less than Fulcrum 3s)

Or should I go for different rims?

- DT Swiss 1.2 (much more aero, much heavier)
- Mavic CXP33 (more aero, slightly heavier)
- Mavic Open Pro (not aero at all, but available in indestructable ceramic CD coating)

I could spend the extra £80 or so for DT Swiss 240 hubs - about 200g less I assume - but that is starting to look very expensive...

Or then there's the Reynolds Solitude wheelset (http://www.wiggle.co.uk/ProductDetail.a ... 5360029718) at £314 which looks to actually use conventional spokes...

(I realise my speed and consistency do not justify any of these...!)

[-Adam-]

DT Swiss make some of the best hubs around, along with Tune (even more expensive) So yeah, DT Swiss all the way!

They make the hubs in most bontrager wheels, including mine. And mine run as smooth today as they did 2 years and probably over 10,000 miles later.

[Hal]

An article in a Cycling Plus a bit ago reviewed wheelsets below £200 and the Planet-X A57 wheels came out tops (10/10 whatever that means).

These are from about £160 depending on how you get them spec'ed up.

I think they also do a higher spec version A537 which should also be pretty good.

H

[Andrew G]

Just ordered some handbuilts for my commuting / training wheels.
Couldn't afford DT Swiss hubs, which would have been my first choice, but for rims, my vote goes to Ambrosio. They make excellent rims, and if you don't trust me then check out how many Paris-Roubaix riders used them (sometimes with a different sticker on top) including O'Grady, Boonen, Cancellara.

I'm building mine on Excellence rims (mid-range) and hope to be out on the CR next week so you can have a shufty then if you're out, and I've got them by then.

[Graham O]

Andrew,

Be really interested to know how they compare with your fulcrums. I know that they will be strong, but from my point of view, the main thing about wheels is that they need to feel both fast and strong.

I notice that my fulcrum 3's are much faster than my bontrager selects for instance.

ta,

Graham.

[Elliot M]

speaking of Planet X they also do these Reynolds Alta Race wheels at 150

http://www.planet-x-bikes.com/road/inde ... on=438:308

Think these were originally at least double that? anyone know if there's a good reason why so cheap??

[Snoop Doug]

OK - pardon me (incoming dumbass question alert) but what's key here? I mean in terms of fast wheels. Can you really get a bike to go noticeably faster with a different set of wheels? It appears you can - so what makes the difference? Is it just weight? Enlighten me...

Why are handbuilt better - is it the choice of having manufacturer x make one bit and y make t'other...?

And finally - is this a sensible mod to make to an old bike like mine? I have campag sciroccos at the mo. I'll be on the CR tomorrow if anyone wants to have a laugh at my aluminium steed and offer me any advice....

Intrigued as always

Snoop

[Elliot M]

aero drag, weight and bearing resistance all components of overall retarding force. but then this varies with speed, acceleration. not a simple topic.

ideally your wheel would be both very aero and very light, but my thinking is unless you go to carbon, aero rims are either significantly heavier (eg the DT Swiss 1.1 vs 1.2, 300g difference per pair) or significantly thinner braking surface, thus less resistant to brake wear/potholes. and if i spend a fair chunk of cash, i want them to last for a while!

Snoop, was pretty impressed with the Sciroccos over the wheels that originally came with my bike. certainly have never needed truing and survived some big old potholes.

[Graham O]

Fast Wheels hmmm.

Quick Accceleration - Lighter rims easier to accelerate (or spin up). Stiffer spokes and build also mean that less power is absorbed by the wheel. Some wheels will flex from side to side when you are trying to accelerate. This is bad..

Aero - Basically aero rims and reduced spoke count cut through the air better...

I had a set of Alta Comp's from GB's. Unfortunately the rear cassette body locked up whilst riding and shredded rear hanger and rear gear. NOt impressed.

I only had them for 5 weeks..

[Andrew G]

Graham,

They won't be as fast as the Fulcrum 3's I've got but I wanted something strong and durable that will survive the commute and potholes of Surrey. I've had Campag Ventos on my other bike for 3-4 years and they were very strong/reliable but the rims are worn down now so they need replacing.

Going for handbuilts as they'll be a better long term purchase, and I can upgrade hubs etc if I want. Also replace rims only etc when they wear. A good handbuilt set will nearly always be stronger and more durable (if heavier) than a factory set.

I'll keep the Fulcrums mainly for best/racing as I feel they are a bit too delicate for general riding, twisting bladed spokes etc. I think I'll just wear them out too quick using them for all my riding, all weathers, all roads etc.

[Graham O]

Just wondered whether you can get comparable performance (i.e. speed)out of a set of handbuilt wheels. I know that factory wheels don't last forever and I also know that Fulcrums are not the strongest (broken spoke after 1 year).

Wondered what the best way to get a strong fast all purpose wheel is?

I guess that the answer = ksyrium ssl / es..

[Elliot M]

but expensive and perhaps not that as aero as all that ...

like the old "strong/light/cheap: pick two" but with more variables

[Jon H]

I don't think any of the "aero" aluminium rims are worth the extra weight penalty over normal rims. For aero benefits to really start coming into play you need at least a 3:1 ratio of length/width. Rims such as CXP33 etc are about 30mm deep, plus a 20/23mm tyre = 50/53mm, width 20/23mm, giving a ratio of between 2:1 and 2.5:1. The only aluminium rims I can recall being really aero were the old Campag Shamals, and they weighed a ton. The only way to go truly aero is with a deep (40-50mm) section carbon rim, and you get light weight too.

[Andrew G]

The lighter the faster. Add aero spokes and fewer in number, deeper rims and they get faster still.

My Dad still has a pair of handbuilt wheels done by Monty of Condors in the 60's. They are sprint rims (tubulars) with tied and soldered spokes and are unbelievable light. These may not have bladed spokes and be box section rims but they would still be pretty fast as they are so light.

A lot of the current factory wheels don't have that lighter rim as they are larger to give a 30mm profile. More aero but heavier. Faster on the flat, but not uphill. Look at the Neutron etc as "climbers" wheels and they still have very little profile.

You pays your money......

[Elliot M]

hmm, good points. swings me back towards the DT 1.1s or Open Pro Ceramic. Sylv was talking about these - I do like the sound of a rim which never wears out from braking....